The Dark Philosophers - Thoughts and Debate
The Dark Philosophers has been another critical success for National Theatre Wales with some fantastic reviews and audience feedback. But of course it wouldn't be a National Theatre Wales show if there weren't a lot of different opinions and passionate ideas about what could have been done differently, or more so, or should always be done this way from now on, or....
It would be great to hear thoughts and opinions and questions on this forum. Some of the questions I'm interested in hearing opinions on are these:
- I chose a physical theatre company to work with us on this adaptation because I felt they would find surprising and engaging ways to tell these larger-than-life stories, and because I felt that a physical approach would bring out the universal elements in these very Welsh tales. What do you think of that choice of a physical approach?
- The piece was staged in a very 'ensemble' style, with actors playing all sorts of roles - young, old, male, female, even goats! Did that add to the experience or did it become confusing?
- We chose to mix a lot of different stories - particularly at the beginning - in an attempt to create a sense of Gwyn Thomas's fictional world. Did that work?
- We also put a 'Gwyn Thomas' character into the mix. What was your feeling about that character - and the choice to use a mask and a very playful, physical style in portraying 'the spirit of Gwyn Thomas?
- We are thinking about touring this show. Do you think it would work on tour, and if so, where to?
These are just some of my questions. You probably have plenty of your own too. It would be great to hear your thoughts.
It would be great to hear thoughts and opinions and questions on this forum. Some of the questions I'm interested in hearing opinions on are these:
- I chose a physical theatre company to work with us on this adaptation because I felt they would find surprising and engaging ways to tell these larger-than-life stories, and because I felt that a physical approach would bring out the universal elements in these very Welsh tales. What do you think of that choice of a physical approach?
- The piece was staged in a very 'ensemble' style, with actors playing all sorts of roles - young, old, male, female, even goats! Did that add to the experience or did it become confusing?
- We chose to mix a lot of different stories - particularly at the beginning - in an attempt to create a sense of Gwyn Thomas's fictional world. Did that work?
- We also put a 'Gwyn Thomas' character into the mix. What was your feeling about that character - and the choice to use a mask and a very playful, physical style in portraying 'the spirit of Gwyn Thomas?
- We are thinking about touring this show. Do you think it would work on tour, and if so, where to?
These are just some of my questions. You probably have plenty of your own too. It would be great to hear your thoughts.
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Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Mel Williams on
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Thanks for this opportunity to discuss the production. Below are some thoughts that I posted in the GROUPS area. I hope they start some debate.
'There were times, as I watched The Dark Philosophers in the Riverfront Theatre, when I found myself thinking that there is very little in Wales that manages to escape the touch of Dylan Thomas. The many-doored set, the "play for voices" moments when snippets of conversation are illuminated and flashed at the audience, the cartoon vignettes of the characters' lives, all were strongly reminiscent of Under Milk Wood. Yet this is not Gwyn Thomas' style. He writes with measured care, in sentences that are often so long that it is wise to carry provisions to see you through to the full-stop at the end, and his, often ironic, powers of observation are achingly funny. How much was there of Cymmer in this, admittedly adventurous, production, and how much of Swansea?'
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Permalink Reply by National Theatre Wales on
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Very interesting question Mel. Of course one of the inherent challenges of the production is to take the rhythms of literary narrative speech in the stories and find the dramatic voice in them. I think the thing we most wanted to avoid was the kind of adaptation that uses the short story narrator's voice as the unifying link - that never really feels like a properly theatrical answer to me. But interesting that you found DT's voice - the polyphonic structure - a kind of ghost in the machine of the show.
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It's more than just the polyphony, I think; both the granular, kaleidoscopic action, particularly at the start, and the imagery of the set convey a patch-work, dream-like quality that can't help but call up the shade of that other Thomas. It may be that the conjuration was more accidental than intended, but that particular ghost, once materialised, is pervasive and hard to exorcise. Gwyn Thomas has his own, distinct, dramatic voice and it is clear enough in the matter of the two dramatised stories - each of them is intended to be an ironic jibe at the oppression of the weak by the strong - but, perhaps in attempting to paint both the man and his mind, the show doesn't quite convey this.
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Permalink Reply by James Doyle-Roberts on
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I’m delighted to hear that “The Dark Philosophers” might become NTW’s first touring production. It fits so well with NTW’s canon so far, and raises its hand well as an exciting statement of your future possibilities. It’s also interesting that the only other purely ‘Theatre House’ show you’ve done in your first year, was “The Devil Inside Him” – a strong and very valid contrast.
In choosing “The Dark Philosophers” to be a physical theatre piece; all of the conversations I’ve had with others who saw it included comments along the lines of ‘what more could you want from a show?’ There is clearly a ready and appreciative audience for this kind of work here; my personal hope is for more and more Welsh artists to seek, and want to create this kind of work.
The dramaturgical choices during the first third of the piece were no more confusing than I saw in early development shows of “Shockheaded Peter” and “Street of Crocodiles” – both of which went on to become absolute smashers!
Don’t listen to Lyn Gardner. The Parkinson piece was a welcome substitute for an interval. Personally, I did have a bit of a head-nod not long after that, but that was probably due to me getting there after a long day of rehearsal.
The choice of putting the ‘Gwyn Thomas’ Mask-character into the mix was perfect. Gwyn Thomas’ stories are hearty theatrical fodder but, they don’t quite stand up on their own as stories to be realised in a theatre. Whilst his writing & storytelling is hugely affecting; the stories themselves are quite simple. Bringing them together under the auspices/gaze/as subjects of The Writer as a character is, as far as I can guess, the only way to tell a collection of stories that represent the reality of the writer, and where these stories came from.
As far as polyphony is concerned, I heard the play as a very different collection of voices compared to Dylan T’s. Told By An Idiot’s style suits the creation of theatrical worlds very well and, in staging what GT was writing about, the work very much needed an ensemble of highly vocal, physically expressive and humanely articulate archetypes. As I’m writing this a foggy distinction is starting to emerge: DT weaves great interplay between well-observed stereotypes; whereas GT was more in the business of telling slightly grim, more emotionally-detailed stories drawn from a world of neighbours and archetypes. Their shared ground is clearly a (very) common sense of humour.
My brain now wants me to try and engage the competing levels of satire versus irony in Gwyn & Dylan Thomas' comparative works, but, I think I’ll just leave that on the table for someone else to pick up.
James
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Permalink Reply by Adam Somerset on
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I feel like the party late-comer with "the Dark Philosophers". I opted for Rhosllanerchrugog over Newport- the Riverfront is great but as a venue is similar to Aberystwyth. Because of the rail strike I ended up at the last performance, rapturously received.
The touring question? The Guardian's weekly "What To See" feature for 19th November ends with
"completely insane if “The Dark Philosophers” doesn't have a future life."
Going to the Stiwt was an inspired choice, a great venue. I take that route four or five times a year as the main way to Liverpool, Manchester, all points North. Even only a couple of miles away I had no idea of the significance of the Clywedog valley. I am no fan of heritage culture but the story at Bersham is amazing. The combination of world-leading technology, business rivalry, legal skullduggery & fraternal hatred reads like Zola with a dash of Euripides.
So not just a theatre of place but a taking-to-new-places.
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I missed that Guardian comment Adam, so thanks for that - nice quote for the touring poster!
James thanks for your insightful thoughts in the great GT/DT debate!
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